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Descoperiri si realizari stiintifice, Aici vorbim despre cercetarile stiintifice si aplicatiile lor
study_nature
post Apr 6 2010, 12:43 PM
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Incep eu cu un studiu de mare anvergura care aduce dovezi in favoarea consumului usor sau moderat de alcool prin evidentierea asocierilor dintre aceste tipuri de consum si scaderea mortalitatii de cauza cardiovasculara. Aceste lucruri le-am mai auzit noi, dar ziceam ca ar fi vorba de efectele benefice ale substantelor provenite din strugurii folositi la prepararea vinului si nu de cele ale alcoolui; in acest studiu se studiaza efectele consumului de alcool, asa ca nu se mai poate folosi acelasi argument. Cel mai socant este daca rezultatele studiului le citesti formulate astfel: ai un risc mai mare de mortalitate de cauza cardiovasculara daca esti abstinent. Formularea aceasta nu e deloc fortata, ci surprinde simpla idee ca daca a<b, atunci b>a. Singura intrebare ramane: oare a<b, mortalitatea celor care consuma putin sau moderat alcool este mai mica decat a celor complet abstinenti? Studiul de fata concluzioneaza ca da.

Dar hai sa prezint cateva detalii tehnice importante:
QUOTE
(...) they used data on 245 207 adults participating in the US National Health Interview Survey (NHIS), an annual survey of a nationally representative sample of US adults, between 1987 and 2000. The survey includes detailed questions on alcohol consumption. Participants were assigned as abstainers (further classified as never drinkers, lifetime infrequent drinkers, or former drinkers), light drinkers (three drinks or less per week), moderate drinkers (four to seven drinks per week for women and four to 14 drinks per week for men), and heavy drinkers (more than seven/14 drinks per week, respectively).

Mortality was ascertained through linkage of the NHIS database to the National Death Index through 2002. The results were adjusted for many covariates, information on which was also recorded on the NHIS questionnaire.


Autorii studiului comenteaza astfel rezultatele:
QUOTE
The authors say: "These data bolster previous epidemiological studies that have found lower rates of incident cardiovascular disease among moderate drinkers but also provide cautionary evidence that drinking above recommended limits eliminates this risk reduction."

The results also provide some of the strongest evidence to date that the observed associations of an inverse relationship between light/moderate alcohol consumption and cardiovascular mortality can be generalized to the US population and are not limited to intensively monitored cohorts of volunteers, they add.


Un editorial care acompaniaza acest studiu, ambele fiind aparute in editia din 30 martie 2010 a Journal of the American College of Cardiology, pentru a echilibra perspectiva prezinta si cateva alte elemente importante pe care nu trebuie sa le ignoram, caci ele pot fi slabiciuni ale studiului aici discutat:
QUOTE
Observing that the risk of breast cancer in women is increased with even moderate drinking and that youthful drinking can often be hazardous, especially when combined with motor vehicles, he makes the point that one universal sensible limit is not possible, and the risks of moderate drinking differ by sex, age, personal history, and family history. "There is no substitute for balanced judgment by a knowledgeable, objective health professional. What is required is a synthesis of common sense and the best available scientific facts," Klatsky concludes.


In ciuda faptului ca noi toti vedem efectele nefaste ale alcoolui asupra oamenilor, efecte de care sunt constient, scriu despre acest studiu cu rezultate avand o dinamica in contrasens principiilor adventiste de dragul surprinderii mai nuantate a realitatii si pentru a initia o dezbatere cu voi pe tema asta.


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"Fix reason firmly in her seat, and call to her tribunal every fact, every opinion. Question with boldness even the existence of a God; because, if there be one, he must more approve of the homage of reason, than that of blindfolded fear."

-- Thomas Jefferson, letter to his nephew Peter Carr, from Paris, August 10, 1787; Merrill D. Peterson, ed., Thomas Jefferson: Writings, New York: Library of America, 1994, pp. 900-906.
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study_nature
post Apr 29 2010, 12:17 PM
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Comentariile mele la postarea "Bubele stiintei" publicata pe blogul Semnelor timpului:

Nu cunosc faptele in sine (ce efecte are Initium, ce studii se fac deja folosind aceasta substanta sau care sunt dezbaterile pe aceasta tema) si nu sunt familiarizat nici cu povestirile despre cercetatorii chinezi. Dar chiar daca si cele mai mari temeri legate de aceste subiecte s-ar adeveri, eu consider ca, pornind de la aceste fapte, nu este benefic sa ne pronuntam in mod radical cu privire la moralitatea sau la efectele negative ale stiintei in general.

Eu n-as avea nicio problema sa ii ofer un asemenea articol, intr-o forma amplificata, cu note de subsol si tot tacamul, unui scientofil extremist in scopul echilibrarii conceptiei sale. Din punctul meu de vedere, sunt multe lucruri pe care le putem face pentru a-i ajuta pe oamenii din aceasta categorie sa fie mai putin impresionabili fata de anumite pretentii exagerate ridicate de unii in privinta avantajelor cunoasterii si aplicarii stiintifice, dar forma de prezentare fata de care ei ar opune cea mai mica rezistenta ar fi tot una apropiata modului de prezentare a review-urilor publicate in revistele de specialitate.

Dar transmis pe un canal precum ST, care are o audienta care include si un segment sceptic fata de oamenii de stiinta si fata de meritele cercetarilor stiintifice sau ale tehnologiilor, efectul oricarui articol critic fata de stiinta va fi de a mari bias-ul in loc de a echilibra perspectivele. O parte dintre cei care formeaza publicul ST sunt suprasaturati de retorica procreationista intr-un mod care ii conduce pe unii spre interpretari conspirationiste despre scopurile stiintei - "pe nedrept numite astfel", as adauga eu la unison cu versetele 1 Timotei 6, 20-21.

In privinta malariei si a studiilor pe tema ei sau, prin extensie, in privinta cercetarii fundamentale in genere, am rezerve fata de gradul de certitudine pe care ni-l propun evaluarile pesimiste cu privire la beneficiile concrete ale articolelor stiintifice. Suntem la un punct din istorie cand, in opinia mea, cea mai mare parte din revolutiile terapeutice majore si facil de obtinut deja au avut loc. Acum se inainteaza cu pasi mici, dar numerosi. E adevarat, sunt si o multime de dead-ends, dar nu exista semne de circulatie, asa ca eu cred ca si cunoasterea cailor de abordare a problemei care nu conduc la solutionare este tot un progres stiintific. Iar viitoarea descoperire fenomenala in managementul sau in preventia malariei se va datora unei uriase piramide de proiecte de cercetare lipsite de atractia senzationalului si dintre care multe au fost publicate cu multi ani in urma, dar fara rezultate vizibile in perioada aceea. Totusi, "prin credinta", acei autori si-au publicat cercetarile aparent inutile. Si chiar daca pana la sfarsitul istoriei nu se va mai descoperi nimic mai bun decat mijloacele pe care le avem la dispozitie azi, efortul colosal si dovedit sisific doar atunci, la eschaton, tot nu va fi complet lipsit de valoare. Printre tipurile de valoare atasate unui asemenea efort de cunoastere si de aplicare eu as include-o printre cele fruntase si pe cea morala, as putea chiar afirma ca exista un imperativ moral de a aborda realitatea dupa metodologia stiintifica, aceasta fiind intemeiata pe rezultate cel mai adesea palpabile, spre deosebire de abordarea bazata doar pe bune intentii si rugaciuni evlavioase dar fara implicare eficienta.

Sunt de acord cu observatia articolului cu privire la faptul ca proportia dintre cercetarile noi si aplicarea lucrurilor deja cunoscute inca nu este calibrata optim, dar este adevarat si ca nu putem sa stabilim in mod absolut care ar fi acel numar phi ce ne-ar indica "raportul de aur" care ar maximiza beneficiul celor care au nevoie de ajutor. In acest context, as mai adauga ca exista o mare posibilitate ca cele mai multe resurse sa fie irosite nu de stabilimentul stiintific, ci de institutiile religioase, care detin o putere mult mai mare decat imi imaginam, resurse in procent semnificativ irosite in razboaie ideologice manifestate atat in eforturile academice teologico-apologetice sustinute denominational, cat si in prozelitismul la firul ierbii, printre oamenii obisnuiti. Iar daca articolele acelea publicate in scopul intelegerii malariei ar fi prea multe, ce sa mai zicem de interminabilele cercetari si polemici teologice milenare, care nici pana azi nu ne aduc implinire si nici pana azi nu ne pot spune nimic cert despre Dumnezeu.

NB: Autorul acestui text, constient fiind de caracterul progresiv dar etern incomplet al cunoasterii, isi rezerva dreptul de a edita continutul acestei postari si al celorlalte care ii apartin. Chiar si religia cea mai apropiata de convingerile sale, cea agnostica, il indeamna sa procedeze astfel, prin urmare bucurati-va daca vi se pare transformata vreo postare candva vizitata.

Vad ca in convingerile mele umanist-agnostice, se pare ca am unele puncte comune cu Jean Rostand, dar in privinta afirmatiei acestuia citata in postarea de pe ST, eu nu cred ca știința ne-a făcut dumnezei si nici ca va putea sa faca asta. In privinta meritului de fi numit om, acesta nu se dobandeste prin adeziunea la un set de dogme si prin punerea lor in aplicare, aceasta devenire intru o fiinta plina de omenie avand in spatele cortinei mecanisme complexe pe care nu putem decat sa le banuim.


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"Fix reason firmly in her seat, and call to her tribunal every fact, every opinion. Question with boldness even the existence of a God; because, if there be one, he must more approve of the homage of reason, than that of blindfolded fear."

-- Thomas Jefferson, letter to his nephew Peter Carr, from Paris, August 10, 1787; Merrill D. Peterson, ed., Thomas Jefferson: Writings, New York: Library of America, 1994, pp. 900-906.
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polihronu
post Apr 29 2010, 12:30 PM
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Si nu le dai macar un link celor de la ST? smile.gif


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"Omul care spune adevarul din cinism este un mincinos" - Bonhoeffer
"Onestitatea intelectuala este o conditie necesara a fericirii" - Paine
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study_nature
post Apr 29 2010, 03:26 PM
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Am comentat si sub postarea de pe site-ul ST urmatoarele chestii in plus:

"Exista totusi cateva puncte slabe ale acestei prezentari a stiintei. In primul rand - se amesteca aspectele ce tin de policy si politica, sfere ce intra in responsabilitatea guvernantilor si a organismelor ce reglementeaza si aproba studiile stiintifice, cu acelea legate de comunitatea stiintifica, grup eterogen ce se indeletniceste cu intelegerea realitatii si apoi aplicarea cunostintelor dobandite in scopul implinirii unor nevoi umane. In al doilea rand, nu mi se pare metodologic riguros sa se prezinte cateva cazuri in care anumiti membri ai comunitatii stiintifice se presupune ca au actionat blamabil, iar ulterior sa se ajunga la concluzii cu privire la bubele stiintei, ca titlu jurnalistic menit sa atraga cu atentia. Din cate stiu, nici cei care se identifica drept crestini nu doresc sa li se impute pacatele predecesorilor sau contemporanilor lor."

Am revizuit si postarea mea anterioara ca sa fie mai aproape de parerea mea in privinta bubelor stiintei vs bubele religiei. smile.gif


--------------------
"Fix reason firmly in her seat, and call to her tribunal every fact, every opinion. Question with boldness even the existence of a God; because, if there be one, he must more approve of the homage of reason, than that of blindfolded fear."

-- Thomas Jefferson, letter to his nephew Peter Carr, from Paris, August 10, 1787; Merrill D. Peterson, ed., Thomas Jefferson: Writings, New York: Library of America, 1994, pp. 900-906.
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Unadapted
post May 1 2010, 08:39 PM
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Felicit si in acelsi timp imi manifest multumirea pt intentia de a deschide topicul asta.Cred ca in cele din urma stiinta si descoperirile stiintifice vor ajunge sa aduca in vederea oamenilor faptul ca Dumnezeu pana la urma este ceva cat se poate de obiectiv.Cu ceva vreme in urma am avut ocazia sa vad un film (documentar?) care explica asa mai p intelesul tutror cateva concepte si descoperiri din domeniul fizicii cuantice.E cam lung(2h:34min) insa ar merita o discutie p urma lui. Las in continuare link-ul : http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-5...263598215344340


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Cowardice asks the question - is it safe? Expedience asks the cuestion is it politic? Vanity asks the cuestion - is it popular? But conscience asks the cuestion - is it RIGHT? And there comes a time when one must take a position that is neither safe,nor politic,nor popular,but one must take it BECAUSE it is Right ! - Martin Luther King
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study_nature
post May 21 2010, 12:50 PM
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Inainte sa incepem sa interpretam cele aflate din mass-media despre "prima bacterie sintetica facuta de om" (formularea celor de la ST):

Puteti asculta interviul luat lui Craig Venter despre reusita proiectului pe care l-a condus.

In mod deosebit ma bucura faptul ca exista acces gratuit la articolul "Creation of a Bacterial Cell Controlled by a Chemically Synthesized Genome" (Crearea unei celule bacteriene controlate de un genom sintetizat chimic) in care echipa de cercetatori care au lucrat la proiect prezinta detaliile principale ale realizarii lor (click aici pentru pdf). Ar fi fain daca mai multi dintre noi am citi informatia de prima mana gasita aici.

Tot pe site-ul Science exista si un pdf de 10 mb cu material suplimentar legat de articol. Aici sunt detalii tehnice pentru cunoscatori, dar si niste figuri si tabele aditionale.

Revin cu amanunte despre promotorul acestui proiect.


--------------------
"Fix reason firmly in her seat, and call to her tribunal every fact, every opinion. Question with boldness even the existence of a God; because, if there be one, he must more approve of the homage of reason, than that of blindfolded fear."

-- Thomas Jefferson, letter to his nephew Peter Carr, from Paris, August 10, 1787; Merrill D. Peterson, ed., Thomas Jefferson: Writings, New York: Library of America, 1994, pp. 900-906.
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eretik
post May 21 2010, 01:07 PM
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Imediat ce intru in "odihna sabatului" ma pun si ma documentez. smile.gif


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"...But you won't listen to reason. It's like playing Chess with a pigeon; no matter how good I am at chess, the pigeon is just going to knock over the pieces, crap on the board and strut around like it's victorious."
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study_nature
post May 21 2010, 01:09 PM
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Craig Venter, conducatorul echipei care a reusit creeze de azi faimoasa celula bacteriana, este un personagiu foarte interesant, de profesie biolog si antreprenor. Va invit sa-i consultati biografia, spre exemplu la pagina dedicata lui pe wikipedia, de unde citez:

QUOTE
Frustrated with what Venter viewed as the slow pace of progress in the Human Genome project, and unable to get funds for his ideas, he sought funding from the private sector to found Celera Genomics. The goal of the company was to sequence the entire human genome and release it into the public domain for non-commercial use in much less time and for much less cost than the public human genome project. The company planned to monetize their work by creating a value added database of genomic data that users could subscribe to for a fee. The goal consequently put pressure on the public genome program and spurred several groups to redouble their efforts to produce the full sequence. DNA from five demographically different individuals was used by Celera to generate the sequence of the human genome; one of them being Venter. In 2000, Venter and Francis Collins of the National Institute of Health and U.S. Public Genome Project jointly made the announcement of the mapping of the human genome in 2000, a full three years ahead of the expected end of the Public Genome Program. The announcement was made along with US President Bill Clinton, and U.K. Prime Minister Tony Blair. Venter and Collins thus shared an award for "Biography of the Year" from A&E Network.[13]


Interesanta legatura dintre el si cunostinta noastra mai veche, evolutionistul teist Francis S Collins, actualmente directorul NIH, institutia publica mamut din domeniul medical din SUA! smile.gif Dar asta nu e tot:

QUOTE
Celera published the first Human Genome in the Journal Science, and was soon followed by a Human Genome Project Publication in Nature.[14][15] Despite some claims that shotgun sequencing was in some ways less accurate than the clone-by-clone method chosen by the Human Genome Project,[16] the technique became widely accepted by the scientific community and is still used today. {din aceste informatii pare ca le-a cam dat clasa celor de la HGP smile.gif Si totusi, iata ce se intampla mai departe:}
After completing the Human Genome, and releasing it into the public domain, Venter was fired by Celera in early 2002.[17] According to his biography, Venter was ready to leave Celera, and was fired due to conflict with the main investor, Tony White, that had existed since day one of the project. Venter writes that his main goal was always to accelerate science and thereby discovery, and he only sought help from the corporate world when he couldn't find funding in the public sector.

Current work
Venter is currently the president of the J. Craig Venter Institute, which conducts research in synthetic biology. In June 2005, he co-founded Synthetic Genomics, a firm dedicated to using modified microorganisms to produce clean fuels and biochemicals. In July 2009, ExxonMobil announced a $600 million collaboration with Synthetic Genomics to research and develop next-generation biofuels.[18]


Mi se pare remarcabil cum a reusit sa gaseasca finantare pentru proiectele lui, dintre care vad ca mai toate au fost incununate de succes. Astept nerabdator sa vad ce se va intampla in continuare cu mica bacterie si cu biocombustibilii.


--------------------
"Fix reason firmly in her seat, and call to her tribunal every fact, every opinion. Question with boldness even the existence of a God; because, if there be one, he must more approve of the homage of reason, than that of blindfolded fear."

-- Thomas Jefferson, letter to his nephew Peter Carr, from Paris, August 10, 1787; Merrill D. Peterson, ed., Thomas Jefferson: Writings, New York: Library of America, 1994, pp. 900-906.
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study_nature
post May 21 2010, 01:49 PM
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Revin la celula bacteriana sintetica, botezata Synthia. Dupa cum ne spune insusi rezumatul articolului din Science,

QUOTE
We report the design, synthesis, and assembly of the 1.08-Mbp Mycoplasma mycoides JCVI-syn1.0 genome starting from digitized genome sequence information and its transplantation into a Mycoplasma capricolum recipient cell to create new Mycoplasma mycoides cells that are controlled only by the synthetic chromosome.


In plus, la pagina 2 a articolului aflam ca genomul de sinteza nu este al unei specii complet noi, ci a fost realizat pe baza secventelor genomice provenite de la doua tulpini de Mycoplasma mycoides subspecia capri, una folosita si de alta echipa, iar cealalta clonata si manipulata prin inginerie genetica:

QUOTE
Design of the M. mycoides JCVI-syn1.0 genome was based on the highly accurate finished genome sequences of two laboratory strains of M. mycoides subspecies capri GM12 (8, 9) (11). One was the genome donor used by Lartigue et al. [GenBank accession CP001621] (10). The other was a strain created by transplantation of a genome that had been cloned and engineered in yeast, YCpMmyc1.1-ΔtypeIIIres, [GenBank accession CP001668] (8).


Ce inseamna de fapt "celula sintetica"? Autorii articolului ne explica mai multe despre creatia lor la pagina 4:

QUOTE
We refer to such a cell controlled by a genome assembled from chemically synthesized pieces of DNA as a “synthetic cell”, even though the cytoplasm of the recipient cell is not synthetic. Phenotypic effects of the recipient cytoplasm are diluted with protein turnover and as cells carrying only the transplanted genome replicate. Following transplantation and replication on a plate to form a colony (>30 divisions or >109 fold dilution), progeny will not contain any protein molecules that were present in the original recipient cell (10, 24). This was previously demonstrated when we first described genome transplantation (10). The properties of the cells controlled by the assembled genome are expected to be the same as if the whole cell had been produced synthetically (the DNA software builds its own hardware).
{pentru o mai buna accesibilitate a textului am bolduit partile importante si usor digerabile}


Gurile rele spun ca realizarea echipei lui Venter nu e chiar atat de mareata. Voi ce ziceti?


--------------------
"Fix reason firmly in her seat, and call to her tribunal every fact, every opinion. Question with boldness even the existence of a God; because, if there be one, he must more approve of the homage of reason, than that of blindfolded fear."

-- Thomas Jefferson, letter to his nephew Peter Carr, from Paris, August 10, 1787; Merrill D. Peterson, ed., Thomas Jefferson: Writings, New York: Library of America, 1994, pp. 900-906.
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icsicsics
post May 21 2010, 05:31 PM
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QUOTE (study_nature @ May 21 2010, 04:49 PM) *
Voi ce ziceti?


io zic ca inca ma uit stramb la toate cele pe care ni le servesti tu aici, azi. smile.gif da' incerc sa pricep. si sa am expectatii ceva mai inalte.

II. am citit nitel si prin media: "joaca de-a dumnezeu". "creatiunea din laborator". sau alte titluri in genul asta... dincolo de senzationescu' romanescu', mai zic ca nu e deloc rau evenimentul zilei.

3. saru-mana!


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"monstrul ratiunii naste somn".
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study_nature
post May 22 2010, 02:47 PM
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Iacata si o schema cu niste explicatii mai clare despre cum e cu bacteria vedeta:




--------------------
"Fix reason firmly in her seat, and call to her tribunal every fact, every opinion. Question with boldness even the existence of a God; because, if there be one, he must more approve of the homage of reason, than that of blindfolded fear."

-- Thomas Jefferson, letter to his nephew Peter Carr, from Paris, August 10, 1787; Merrill D. Peterson, ed., Thomas Jefferson: Writings, New York: Library of America, 1994, pp. 900-906.
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study_nature
post May 22 2010, 03:17 PM
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Cateva fragmente din articolul lui Nicholas Wade din The New York Times, spre care v-am trimis intr-una din postarile mele anterioare cand m-am referit la "gurile rele":

QUOTE
At a press conference Thursday, Dr. Venter described the converted cell as “the first self-replicating species we’ve had on the planet whose parent is a computer.”

“This is a philosophical advance as much as a technical advance,” he said, suggesting that the “synthetic cell” raised new questions about the nature of life

Other scientists agree that he has achieved a technical feat in synthesizing the largest piece of DNA so far — a million units in length — and in making it accurate enough to substitute for the cell’s own DNA.

But some regard this approach as unpromising because it will take years to design new organisms, and meanwhile progress toward making biofuels is already being achieved with conventional genetic engineering approaches in which existing organisms are modified a few genes at a time.
{textul a fost ingrosat de mine}


Detalii tehnice si financiare:
QUOTE
The team ordered pieces of DNA 1,000 units in length from Blue Heron, a company that specializes in synthesizing DNA, and developed a technique for assembling the shorter lengths into a complete genome. The cost of the project was $40 million, most of it paid for by Synthetic Genomics, a company Dr. Venter founded.


Despre stilul de viata al lui Venter, sau despre imbinarea utilului cu placutul:
QUOTE
On his yacht trips round the world, Dr. Venter has analyzed the DNA of the many microbes in seawater and now has a library of about 40 million genes, mostly from algae. These genes will be a resource to make captive algae produce useful chemicals, he said.


Critici din partea altor oameni de stiinta:
QUOTE
Some other scientists said that aside from assembling a large piece of DNA, Dr. Venter has not broken new ground. “To my mind Craig has somewhat overplayed the importance of this,” said David Baltimore, a geneticist at Caltech. He described the result as “a technical tour de force,” a matter of scale rather than a scientific breakthrough.

“He has not created life, only mimicked it,” Dr. Baltimore said.

(...)

Dr. Venter’s assertion that he has created a “synthetic cell” has alarmed people who think that means he has created a new life form or an artificial cell. “Of course that’s not right — its ancestor is a biological life form,” said Dr. Joyce of Scripps.

Dr. Venter copied the DNA from one species of bacteria and inserted it into another. The second bacteria made all the proteins and organelles in the so-called “synthetic cell,” by following the specifications implicit in the structure of the inserted DNA.


--------------------
"Fix reason firmly in her seat, and call to her tribunal every fact, every opinion. Question with boldness even the existence of a God; because, if there be one, he must more approve of the homage of reason, than that of blindfolded fear."

-- Thomas Jefferson, letter to his nephew Peter Carr, from Paris, August 10, 1787; Merrill D. Peterson, ed., Thomas Jefferson: Writings, New York: Library of America, 1994, pp. 900-906.
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study_nature
post May 23 2010, 05:11 AM
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Revin cu detalii despre bacteria sintetica: aici aflati despre cateva obstacole importante pe care oamenii de stiinta din echipa lui Venter le-au depasit pe parcursul proiectului. Iar pe site-ul Science, gasiti o sesiune Q&A bine pusa la punct, din care mai multe fragmente s-ar preta sa fie citate, dar hai sa selectez doar unul despre implicatiile religioase:

QUOTE
Q: Does the discovery challenge religious notions about the creation of life and the concept of a spirit?

M.B.: The creation of life from nonlife (fully synthetic cells) might well impact some religious and cultural world views, and the achievement of a partly synthetic cell already opens the door to these implications. The achievement of Venter’s team vividly demonstrates that the genome of simple life forms is nothing more than a complex molecule constructed out of nothing more than certain chemicals. (Most molecular biologists have already believed this for many generations, of course.) This result strongly implies that fully synthetic cells would likewise be merely very complex chemical devices, created out of nothing more than chemical ingredients that are organized in the appropriate way. There is no need for a concept of “spirit” or nonchemical “vital spark” to explain simple bacterial life. This, in turn, in my opinion, implies (but does not prove) that more complex forms of life, including humans, are essentially nothing more than exceedingly complex chemical devices, and so there is no need for a concept of “spirit” or “vital spark” to explain what make humans alive.


In ce masura rezonati cu raspunsul acesta?


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"Fix reason firmly in her seat, and call to her tribunal every fact, every opinion. Question with boldness even the existence of a God; because, if there be one, he must more approve of the homage of reason, than that of blindfolded fear."

-- Thomas Jefferson, letter to his nephew Peter Carr, from Paris, August 10, 1787; Merrill D. Peterson, ed., Thomas Jefferson: Writings, New York: Library of America, 1994, pp. 900-906.
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polihronu
post May 23 2010, 01:00 PM
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Pentru o alternativa la "stirea" ST, aici.

PS Apropo de mari realizari stiintifice, de ce nu-mi spune si mie nimeni din timp ca urmeaza sa se joaca finala Ligii campionilor si trebuie sa aflu din intimplare doar a doua zi, huh?


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"Omul care spune adevarul din cinism este un mincinos" - Bonhoeffer
"Onestitatea intelectuala este o conditie necesara a fericirii" - Paine
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skeptic
post May 23 2010, 02:15 PM
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QUOTE (polihronu @ May 23 2010, 04:00 PM) *
Pentru o alternativa la "stirea" ST, aici.

PS Apropo de mari realizari stiintifice, de ce nu-mi spune si mie nimeni din timp ca urmeaza sa se joaca finala Ligii campionilor si trebuie sa aflu din intimplare doar a doua zi, huh?


Daca te grabesti, prinzi ultimii 40 de km din etapa de azi a Turului Italiei la ciclism wink.gif


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"I want the truth!" "You can't handle the truth!"
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study_nature
post Jun 18 2010, 07:29 PM
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Deep Brain Stimulation nu este o tehnica terapeutica deloc noua, dar multe studii sunt inca in desfasurare pentru a-i lamuri anumite aspecte, cum ar fi mecanismele, efectele, indicatiile, eficienta. Unele dintre beneficiile pe care le ofera sunt prezentate in acest clip despre cazul unui violonist nefericit.

Saiens rullz! And so does medicine!

PS: Answers to prayers seem to come by the same routes!


--------------------
"Fix reason firmly in her seat, and call to her tribunal every fact, every opinion. Question with boldness even the existence of a God; because, if there be one, he must more approve of the homage of reason, than that of blindfolded fear."

-- Thomas Jefferson, letter to his nephew Peter Carr, from Paris, August 10, 1787; Merrill D. Peterson, ed., Thomas Jefferson: Writings, New York: Library of America, 1994, pp. 900-906.
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Teologul
post Jul 3 2010, 08:53 PM
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Legat de sinteza artificiala a bacteriei, am parerea ca nu poate fi vorba nici pe departe de vreun act de creatie. Cercetatorii s-au folosit de un material genetic deja existent, pe care l-au asamblat intr-o anumita forma si a iesit un fenotip. Defectul principal al teoriei evolutioniste este acela ca nu poate explica convingator cum a aparut prima molecula de ADN, intrucat proteinele implicate in sinteza si replicarea lui sunt produse chiar de el. Practic ar fi trebuit ca atat ADN-ul, cat si proteinele-enzime sa apara simultan, din surse diferite, dar avand in vedere ca in decursul unor miliarde de ani doar una din sinteze este posibila pe cale spontana, probabilitatea cuplarii celor doua elemente e aproape nula.
Din acest motiv, in ultimele decenii, o parte dintre evolutionisti au adoptat o pozitie deista, afirmand ca admit existenta unor interventii episodice din afara, dirijate in mod inteligent, pentru ca intregul proces sa primeasca anumite impulsuri absolut necesare dezvoltarii sale. Desigur ca nu s-a putut stabili nimic despre natura acestei influente exterioare, aici parerile sunt impartite intre cercetatori, multi inclinand sa dea credit ipotezei extraterestre, ce pare sa se confirme acum, cand s-au descoperit o multime de planete pe alte sisteme solare invecinate, si s-au stabilit si criteriile necesare unei anumite planete pentru a putea adaposti viata organica la suprafata ei.


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"Nu recunosc alt semn al superioritatii umane decat bunatatea" (Ludwig van Beethoven)
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study_nature
post Jul 3 2010, 09:00 PM
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QUOTE (Teologul @ Jul 3 2010, 11:53 PM) *
Defectul principal al teoriei evolutioniste este acela ca nu poate explica convingator cum a aparut prima molecula de ADN, intrucat proteinele implicate in sinteza si replicarea lui sunt produse chiar de el.


Creationismul sau teologia explica in mod convingator cum a aparut Dumnezeu?


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"Fix reason firmly in her seat, and call to her tribunal every fact, every opinion. Question with boldness even the existence of a God; because, if there be one, he must more approve of the homage of reason, than that of blindfolded fear."

-- Thomas Jefferson, letter to his nephew Peter Carr, from Paris, August 10, 1787; Merrill D. Peterson, ed., Thomas Jefferson: Writings, New York: Library of America, 1994, pp. 900-906.
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Teologul
post Jul 5 2010, 08:04 PM
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QUOTE (study_nature @ Jul 4 2010, 12:00 AM) *
Creationismul sau teologia explica in mod convingator cum a aparut Dumnezeu?


Nu este acelasi lucru. Echivalentul evolutionist al lui Dumnezeu e autorul big-bang-ului. In cazul ADN-ului, se pare ca echivalentul biblic (creationist) ar fi "pomul vietii", potrivit lui Cristian Negureanu, care considera ca autorului Genezei i s-ar fi aratat molecula dublu spiralata, pe care el a asemanat-o cu un pomisor. Interzicerea accesului la acest pom al vietii s-ar fi facut prin distrugerea premeditata a unor baze de date ce contineau informatii complete despre genomul uman, pe care stramosii nostri atlanti si hiperboreeni le-ar fi detinut. Acum s-a reusit decodificarea genomului uman, dar numai din punct de vedere chimic, intrucat functiile precise ale proteinelor sunt in cea mai mare parte necunoscute.
Se stie ca limitarea vietii umane la o valoare de 80-100 de ani se datoreaza epuizarii unor secvente cromozomiale numite telomeri, care opresc diviziunea celulara dupa un anumit nr. de generatii, urmata de moartea biologica. Cunoasterea secretului pastrarii acestor zone terminale de pe cei 46 de cromozomi ne-ar permite sa traim vesnic.


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"Nu recunosc alt semn al superioritatii umane decat bunatatea" (Ludwig van Beethoven)
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kla
post Jul 5 2010, 08:08 PM
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QUOTE (Teologul @ Jul 5 2010, 11:04 PM) *
[...]Cunoasterea secretului pastrarii acestor zone terminale de pe cei 46 de cromozomi ne-ar permite sa traim vesnic.

Acum inteleg mai bine necesitatea economisirii in sistem de pensii private. Daca peste 20 de ani se descopera elixirul tineretii? Nici nu vreau sa ma gandesc la marirea varstei de pensionare pana spre 150 de ani.

Revenind intr-o maniera mai serioasa, am constatat ca desi tabelele de mortalitate (cu care opereaza firmele de asigurari) indica cifra 0 pentru probabilitatea de supravietuire dupa varsta de 100 de ani, totusi unele firme de asigurari ofera o pensie viagera dar pana la o varsta nu mai mare de 95 de ani. Cred ca descoperirea hartilor de care se vorbeste in postarea anterioara e cea mai mare spaima a lor.
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